Indigo De Souza is working on a painting. After taking some psychedelics, she turned to canvas, unspooling her perspective of the natural world in color. The painting is big and abstract and energetic, much like her music — her creativity bleeds into assorted forms, and in its fluidity, De Souza yields to no one.

The 25-year-old, North Carolina-based musician is agile, wedging honest confessions between raging guitar licks and rapid-fire drums. A resilient embrace of change sculpted her first two acclaimed albums, I Love My Mom (2018) and Any Shape You Take (2021), but this acceptance takes center stage on the recently released All Of This Will End. Listening to it feels like standing in the eye of a hurricane, but instead of trying to vanquish the disorder, De Souza masters the restlessness.

It's no wonder she's a rising star in the grunge and indie rock scene, playing major festivals and touring with everyone from Lucy Dacus to Alex G. While her music — and consequent ascent to fame — has occasionally been turbulent, she's found ways to ground herself spiritually. Most importantly, she cited close community as a key source of meaning in her life.

"[Community] has led me to this point of not only being vulnerable with my songs, but also wanting to create a safe space for everybody that is listening, because I know how special that feels," De Souza tells GRAMMY.com. "I know how much everybody needs that to feel like they are belonging and they are worth being here."

In realizing her self-worth and dedicating herself to fostering safe spaces, De Souza is more free than she's ever been. Part of this aspiration for liberty comes from her artist mother, who painted all of De Souza's album covers. Each depicts an evocative scene of skeletons — wallowing, embracing, searching for connection — amid lush greenery. They're stirring, exquisite images that encapsulate mortality, another key theme of De Souza's angsty music.

On the aptly titled All Of This Will End, De Souza comes to terms with her mortality and holds it with strength. A rich, red horizon floods the album cover; though the sun is going down, the musician lingers in the light while she can.

Ahead of her record's release, Indigo De Souza spoke with GRAMMY.com about embracing life's temporality, how close-knit communities fuel her creativity, and why her latest album is her truest representation of herself yet.

This interview has been edited for length and clarity.

What did you discover about yourself while working on All of This Will End?

I feel like more than the other albums, I trusted my own voice more. I feel like the process was faster than the other two albums because there was a lot of just going with my gut and not second guessing stuff as much.

That was probably the biggest thing I learned because coming from the last album, I kind of decided this time that I wanted to fully self-produce it. But I wanted help from Alex [Farrar] who worked on the last album as well, and he just became a really special collaborator throughout the last album. And then I really wanted to pull him into this one. And it was such a sweet pairing of energies to kind of lead the [album].

Also, one of my best friends, my soulmate, Dexter Webb plays all of the crazy shreddy guitar stuff on the album. He also plays the sweet piano in "Younger & Dumber," and he is just very, very talented in so many ways. And he did a lot of the production as well.

But yeah, I think I just learned to trust myself and trust my inner community to make the thing that felt the most true, and I kind of feel like that same thing happened with my music videos this time around. 

On "Younger & Dumber," you sing that "you're tired of feeling the space all around you," and I really connected to that. Elaborate on that feeling.

I've had that feeling ever since I was young. I think I'm just a kind of deeply depressed person, but it's also a very deep existential doom. And I have anxiety as well, and I just have a lot of issues. 

I'm fine day to day by myself. I used to not be able to function as well, and I was not able to make money because of it, because I was just kind of in bed all the time. But now I feel very functional and able to do a lot of things — have community, really show up in my life, and make it mean something.

I think that that feeling is just that sometimes I get tired of fighting. Sometimes I get tired of creating meaning and intention and doing things to help my life succeed or doing things to feed myself or feed my creativity.

All Of This Will End  hones in on mortality, and I think there's something really peaceful in accepting that everything is temporary. How does making music give you purpose, within that context of mortality?

The acceptance of mortality allows me to make music that is directly from the heart, and is completely true and is very vulnerable and raw. I don't feel precious about keeping that to myself. I don't feel scared of being open about my feelings because they're fleeting, and I know that at the end of it all, I'm going to die.

So I feel like it's important to show up in my truest form and actually connect with people in a real way. It allows me to pour a lot of meaning into my live shows as well, because I really love sharing the songs and being able to share actual space with [the audience]. And it really is such a magical feeling when you pour your heart out on stage, and then feel everyone in the room kind of energetically shift into a space of vulnerability as well.

You talked about how accepting mortality helps you make the most out of life. What are some of the little things in life that you've found meaning in?

I like being around a fire with my friends. And that's one of my favorite things — being in nature and making a fire and sitting around it and talking. I really like going out into the forest with my dog and just watching him play in the forest and in the creek because he's just a total creature. It's his favorite place, and he needs to go there every day to feel good. And I love just having a hot drink with my best friend and roommate in the morning. 

What's your relationship with nature, and how has it affected your creative process?

So much of my pain and grief about the world comes from humans' unhealthy relationship to nature or disconnected relationship to nature. A lot of things that humans build and create is actively ruining nature and choking nature. And a lot of people don't even have a connection to nature anymore because of how technological everything has become or how separate everything has become… It brings out a lot for me emotionally, which then pours into my music.

I think that's why I wrote about parking lots a lot in this album. Ever since I was young and I heard that song about paving the parking lot, I remember it made me think about the fact that parking lots were paved. And then at some point I started realizing, oh, it wasn't always this way. 

We built all this stuff and we paved over actual forests, and there's all this magic around us that we don't know how to tap into. And that's really strange. Now I know there are people who do know how to tap into that magic, but they're more rare. I think I'm surrounded by people like that in my life now, which is really important.

You're definitely tapping into that magic. Following your parking lot paving realization, how did you confront change when you were younger? And how does that compare to how you cope with it now?

There's different kinds of change. There's change that is out of your control and you're just watching it happen. And then there's change that you can take control of in your own life. I'm going to move here. I'm going to make a boundary with this person. I'm going to cut my hair off.

I think when I was young, I felt like a lot of my change was out of my control because I was small and I was under the roof of my mom. I remember feeling really stuck at school, like really sad that I just had to be in a room in a fluorescent square box every day. I've read journals from when I was young and there's some really emo s— in there.

When you're touring, you have to perform really personal songs over and over. Is it ever difficult to revisit those songs frequently, or does it just feel more therapeutic to perform them often?

It feels really therapeutic, especially now since we're playing this new album. The last album got really old for me and started to actually be painful to revisit, but now I have a couple new bandmates and we've kind of reworked some of those songs to keep playing them live. Honestly having a fresh new perspective of them and having taken a long break from them gives me a second wind.

What does community look like and feel like to you, whether that's on tour or just at home?

I think all that community means to me is having safe space between people for expression and true communication — whether something hurts someone's feelings or is just a need that needs to be communicated. 

I really feel like one of the main beauties of true community is being able to face conflict in a way that actually triggers growth between people and is actually a space to find deeper meaning and understanding instead of separation… In that same breath, I also feel that way just about dark, sad feelings. It's better to talk about that instead of holding it inside.

Your openness and love of community translates to your latest album, to the point where it feels like you're building a safe space for listeners. How did you gradually learn to be comfortable with being so vulnerable? Or do you still find yourself adjusting sometimes?

There was a time when I had friends around me who I was vulnerable with, and they actually really hurt me in response. That felt like a moment that really stunted my growth… and that was right after I put out Any Shape You Take. And it was during the pandemic, and I was alone for a while.

Then I started to meet these new friends that were kind of farther out from the city, in the sticks, and I started hanging out with them in nature. And then the community just got bigger and bigger. I think what taught me to be very strong in my vulnerability is that I opened up to them and they did not turn me away. They, in turn, opened up to me and we began learning about each other, and it created these really close bonds that actually gave deep, deep meaning to my life and helped me feel like I had a place in the world.

I wanted to talk about your mom, who's a major inspiration to you. What have you learned from her? Which of her traits have inspired you the most?

I think that the trait that has inspired me the most about her is that she does not care about what people think of her. She's always been very loud with her artwork, and she will just go to an event wearing a crazy costume with a mask. When I was young, I was really embarrassed by her. And then as I got older, I realized how special it was that she didn't care about what people thought.

I was always so confused about why we weren't leaving the town because the town was so unaccepting, but she was dedicated to being someone who was bringing new life to the town and who was making it feel like a space where other artsy people could come. And she just really loved that place and didn't want to abandon it.

I think that's kind of how I feel now too. In this area where I live, there are a lot of problematic things going on. It's the South, so there's people who mean harm to minorities and don't accept the queerness, but I don't want to abandon this place because I really love the nature and I love the people. I love the people who are fighting for this space to be a safe space. I think she taught me that too: to not abandon the things that you love.

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Another summer, another Newport Folk. The storied bastion of American roots music flourished once again, with three days of plucks, strums, harmonies and good cheer.

Lana Del Rey enjoyed her Newport debut, James Taylor made a surprise appearance (calling it "emergency folk music") and the Black Opry made waves — and GRAMMY.com was on the grounds for all of the excitement.

Backstage, a number of artists chatted about their experiences onstage, their love of the American roots community and more.

Watch all of the interviews below — and we'll see you at Newport Folk 2024!

Turnpike Troubadours

Nickel Creek

John Oates

Abraham Alexander

Bella White

Gregory Alan Isakov

Indigo de Souza

M. Ward

Thee Sacred Souls

Rob Grant

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There are few purer things online than the YouTube comments to Smash Mouth's "All Star."

The splashy, hook-stuffed, puppyish earworm rocketed into most of our hippocampi via 2001's Shrek, and it never left. Chances are it's playing in your head right now. No "-body" ever followed a "Some-" like this. And when lead singer Steve Harwell tragically passed in 2023, folks of all backgrounds flooded the video in droves to pay their respects.

"You really were an 'All Star,'" declared one commenter. "One of the coolest guys to ever live," opined another. "As a wise man once said, only shootin' stars break the mold." "He may not have been the sharpest tool in the shed," a third commenter said, "but now he's the brightest star in the sky."

They don't stop coming: "All Star" really galvanized a generation of kids to go for it, and chase their dreams. And 25 years since its release on May 4, 1999, the maddeningly catchy single from 1999's Astro Lounge, continues to hurtle forth. Millennials know it from "Shrek." Gen Z knows it for the memes (oh, somanymemes). But it's also just a bulletproof — and totally unforgettable — pop song.

Written by founding guitarist and vocalist Greg Camp, "All Star" seemed to take the best parts of Y2K-era hits and Frankenstein them together. Which arose from necessity: Smash Mouth had just had a smash with "Walkin' on the Sun," from their 1997 debut Fush Yu Mang, and the pressure was on to follow it up.

"One night I sat Greg down, opened up a Billboard magazine, and said, 'Dude, let's just go through this. I want a little piece of each one of these songs," Smash Mouth's manager, Robert Hayes, told Rolling Stone. As he explained, the top 50 contained the likes of Sugar Ray, Third Eye Blind, Barenaked Ladies, and Chumbawumba — as well as Smash Mouth themselves.

"He left, and two days later, he walks into my office with a cassette tape. I popped it in and there was 'All Star' on this cassette," Hayes continued. "I stopped, and I looked at him. He goes, "What? You don't like it?" I said, "Are you friggin' kidding me? This is a smash!"

As bassist Paul DeLisle put it, "All Star" was a response to letters Harwell would receive from the youth. The lyrics "were just sort of like a pep talk, almost," he explained in the same piece. The song was [for] these kids: "Hang in there. You are the master of your own domain. You control your own ship."

"All Star" was a head-turning song, and best of all, it was beamed to the right act for the job. Not for nothing was it nominated for Best Pop Performance By A Duo Or Group With Vocal at the 2000 GRAMMYs. "I'm not going to toot my own horn, but nobody else could have sang that song," Harwell rightly declared. "It would have never been what it is now. I could've pitched that song to a million bands and they would have tried to do it, and it would've never been what it is."

The band and record company both flipped for "All Star" — and what helped tremendously was its licensability. "I licensed the crap outta that song," Hayes said. "You could not walk into a grocery store or turn on the television without hearing 'All Star.' It was very, very saturated."

As impossible as it seems today, Smash Mouth initially turned down use of "All Star" in Shrek. But Dreamworks kept knocking, and eventually flew a rep to play the film for them. When the band beheld the quality of Shrek, they caved. The result was a phenomenon — partly because it nailed the character of the titular ogre.

As the co-director of Shrek, Vicky Jenson, put it, "All Star" was a really fun, upbeat way to really understand Shrek right from the get-go." Which could apply to kids the world over as well — their boundless energy, their limitless senses of possibility.

"Only shooting stars break the mold," the late Harwell trumpeted with dizzying enthusiasm — and today, that mold lies shattered at our feet. We may never see the likes of Smash Mouth, or "All Star," again.

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Between two award seasons, A Star Is Born received seven nominations — including Record Of The Year and two nods for Song Of The Year — and four wins for Best Compilation Soundtrack for Visual Media, Best Song Written for Visual Media twice, and Best Pop/Duo Group Performance.

In this episode of GRAMMY Rewind, travel to 2019 to watch Lady Gaga accept one of the album's first GRAMMY wins for Best Pop/Duo Group Performance for "Shallow."

After thanking God and her family for their unwavering support, Lady Gaga expressed gratitude for her co-star, Bradley Cooper. "I wish Bradley was here with me right now," Gaga praised. "I know he wants to be here. Bradley, I loved singing this song with you."

Gaga went on to express how proud she was to be a part of a movie that addresses mental health. "A lot of artists deal with that. We've got to take care of each other. So, if you see somebody that's hurting, don't look away. And if you're hurting, even though it might be hard, try to find that bravery within yourself to dive deep, tell somebody, and take them up in your head with you."

Press play on the video above to hear Lady Gaga's complete acceptance speech for A Star Is Born's "Shallow" at the 2019 GRAMMY Awards, and check back to GRAMMY.com for more new episodes of GRAMMY Rewind.

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As someone who has dedicated her life to being a performer, Dua Lipa's recent admission to Apple Music's Zane Lowe seems almost unfathomable: "I never thought of the idea of being famous."

Stardom may not have been on her mind as a kid, but Lipa is now, indeed, one of the most famous pop stars on the planet as she releases her highly anticipated third album, Radical Optimism. 

In the seven years since her acclaimed 2017 self-titled debut, Lipa has achieved several highs — like three GRAMMY wins, including Best New Artist in 2019 — as well as the subsequent lows that can often come with global stardom. And though the singer also admitted to Lowe that it "took me a while to find my voice," Radical Optimism is her most self-assured album yet — one that hinges on the title being not only the project's name, but also its defining approach to Lipa's present-day vision for her life.

"Radical Optimism and the way that I see it is this idea of rolling with the punches, of not letting anything get you down for too long. Of always seeing the positive side of things. Of being able to grow and move forward and change your perspective regardless of what's happening in your life…I think it's a big part of maturing and growing up."

The entire album was crafted in her native London over the course of a year-and-a-half, with Lipa enlisting a small band of collaborators — including her righthand co-writer Caroline Ailin, Kevin Parker of Tame Impala, Danny L. Harle and Tobias Jesso, Jr. — to create a cohesive, buoyant body of work tinged with disco, funk and bits of psychedelic pop.

Naturally, "radical optimism" is a core thread that runs through all eleven songs as Lipa reflects on falling in and out of love, grapples with her fame and confidently declares that everything that came before Radical Optimism was just a practice run. After all, as she brazenly declares on the LP's second single, "Training season's over." 

As you enter Dua's latest musical world, dive into four major takeaways from Radical Optimism below.

Radical Optimism Isn't Just A New Era — It's A Whole New Perspective

When Lipa accepted her GRAMMY for Best Pop Vocal Album in 2021, she declared she was officially done with the "sad music" that had fueled her breakout debut album. And if 2020's Future Nostalgia was, in context, a kind of clubby, '80s-driven turning point for the artist, she fully embraces the Radical Optimism promised by its follow-up's title. Lipa's newfound attitude is both clear-eyed and relentlessly positive across the album's 11 tracks, whether she's gushing over a new love on giddy opener "End of an Era," being kept up all night by thoughts of a seductive crush on "Whatcha Doing" or cutting her losses and ditching out early on the spellbinding "French Exit."

Even "These Walls," on which she watches a doomed relationship fade to black, is approached with a sense of inevitability laced with clarity and astute kindness. "But if these walls could talk/ They'd say enough, they'd say give up/ If these walls could talk/ They'd say/ You know you're f—ed/ It's not supposed to hurt this much/ Oh, if these walls could talk/ They tell us to break up," Lipa sings over gossamer production and a piano line by Andrew Wyatt.

You Can Still Find Her On The Dance Floor

The rollout for Radical Optimism was front-loaded with the release of three singles ahead of the full album in the form of "Houdini," "Training Season" and "Illusion." Between the three subsequent music videos and a thrilling live performance at the 2024 GRAMMYs in February, Lipa signaled that her third LP would be filled with her signature style of scintillating dance floor bangers.

The rest of the album more than delivers on that promise, with an overall BPM that rarely falls below what's needed for a full-blown aerobic workout — perfect for over-the-top choreography, of course. And in case the Service95 founder's commitment to the dance floor isn't already apparent, just look at the history-making hat trick she recently pulled off on the Billboard's Hot Dance/Electronic Songs chart: as of press time, "Houdini," "Illusion" and "Training Season" occupied the top three spots, marking a first for any female artist in modern music history.

She's Redefining Love On Her Own Terms

If the litany of love songs on Radical Optimism are any indication, it's safe to say Lipa is head over heels these days (with boyfriend Callum Turner, perhaps?). Opening track "End of an Era" may mark the beginning of a new musical journey for the singer, but it's just as much about the thrill of a new relationship. Later on the track list, she uses album cut "Falling Forever" to grow an initial spark of infatuation into a red-hot love affair as she yearns, "How long, how long/ Can it just keep getting better?/ Can we keep falling forever" on the lovestruck chorus.

Lipa also makes it clear on the shapeshifting highlight "Anything For Love" that she's "not interested in a love that gives up so easily." As she refuses to accept the modern paradigm of ghosting, non-committal situationships and running away when things get hard, the song morphs from a tender piano ballad into danceable, mid-tempo groove, giving the listener just enough breathing room to wrestle with the questions of what kind of love they'll accept before dancing it out.

She's Putting Her Emotional Growth On Full Display

It's been almost seven years since Lipa spelled out her "New Rules" for a generation of pop lovers, and some of the most affecting cuts on Radical Optimism prove the British-Albanian star has accrued even more hard-won wisdom since her early days of "If you're under him, you ain't gettin' over him."

Penultimate track "Maria" finds Lipa thanking the ghost of her current lover's ex-girlfriend for making him a better man: "Never thought I could feel this way/ Grateful for all the love you gave/ Here's to the lovers that make you change/ Maria, Maria, Maria." 

Meanwhile, on album closer "Happy for You," the singer turns her attention not to a lover's ex-girlfriend, but to an ex who's moved on from her and found himself happier than ever. It's a complex, but decidedly mature feeling to realize you're genuinely happy for someone you used to love, but Lipa encapsulates the emotion perfectly. 

"Oh, I must've loved you more than I ever knew/ Didn't know I could ever feel/ 'Cause I'm happy for you," she sings on the chorus. "Now I know everything was real/ I'm not mad, I'm not hurt/ You got everything you deserve/ Oh, I must've loved you more than I ever knew/ I'm happy for you."

The grown-up sentiment finishes the album on a bittersweet emotional high — proving that no matter what life throws at her, Lipa will remain radically and unapologetically optimistic to the end. 

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